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atomic33
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Posted: Mon Oct 27th, 2008 12:44 pm |
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Dee u always know how to put things in perspective I am sorry for your loss It is a lesson for all of us
It would be fab for there to be no hardship in peoples lives but unfortunatly there is
Tis a shame
I cant wait for the transformation
Blessings and much love to all xxxxxxxxx
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RedBird
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Posted: Wed Oct 29th, 2008 01:44 am |
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Politics is wonderful to discuss. Great political thinkers have been God's gift to the planet. I love talking about democracy. It does go hand in hand with capitalism. These are not bad things to discuss. They are very good things to discuss.
I use to be very concerned about the way things 'should be.' But the belief did not serve me well. I also learned that all those things out there I was bothered by so much were to teach me what I needed to heal inside, along with compassion and perseverance. But I do not believe those things are to make us lose our passion or love for today. Or to cause us to fail to see the blessings and abundance that we have right now.
As for the video, my observation is that the video is anti-American and anti-capitalist. I do not find it as a tool for presenting solutions for current problems but more as a tool to spread fear and anti-American sentiment. I say this here to issue a caution. It is certainly anyone's choice as to what they choose to light the fire of passion under them for.
It just seems to me that it is more productive to see the good we have now, to guard our passions for what gives us joy rather than squander them in fear. So I say again: Democracy and capitalism, free trade, all these things are fundamentally good. If you live in a democracy, if you live in a country where you can choose your life, then the only thing you are a slave to is your own limiting beliefs. There is nothing quite so beautiful and challenging as freedom. We are only left to figure out what to do with it.
RedBird
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Multisingularity
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Posted: Wed Oct 29th, 2008 02:25 am |
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It's not to spread fear... It tells the truth. you interpret it as spreading fear because you don't want to admit what is. You are able of seeing all the blessing we have today because you are lucky enough to have them. You can stay safe in your bubble, and that's fine. But to claim that everything is OK and to turn a blind eye to those that are suffering. It is to be part of the problem to not want to work towards a solution. These issues don't just touch the United states, but all of the world. The video spreads the truth about what is going on. if you deem it as anti-american and anti-capitalist, it's because you are too stern in these systems to admit that change could be beneficial. You claim that pain and suffering teaches... and it's true that it does... But being homeless when working is just torturing. Using children as slaves in order to turn a profit is not right. Paying CEO's 2 billion dollars a year while paying workers 6,7,8 dollars an hour is absurd. Please for the love of everyone and everything, stop being so stern in the ways of past that you refuse to admit that anything better could exist.
Fear of change is a horrible thing, especially when it is much needed. Don't be a rock, always keep your mind open to see the possibilities. Just because many of the atrocities aren't happening to you... doesn't mean they are not happening...
PS. I'm done with this thread... It's really starting to depress me..
Love to EVERYONE..
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RedBird
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 12:30 am |
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Multisingularity wrote:
It's not to spread fear... It tells the truth. you interpret it as spreading fear because you don't want to admit what is. You are able of seeing all the blessing we have today because you are lucky enough to have them. You can stay safe in your bubble, and that's fine. But to claim that everything is OK and to turn a blind eye to those that are suffering. It is to be part of the problem to not want to work towards a solution. These issues don't just touch the United states, but all of the world. The video spreads the truth about what is going on. if you deem it as anti-american and anti-capitalist, it's because you are too stern in these systems to admit that change could be beneficial. You claim that pain and suffering teaches... and it's true that it does... But being homeless when working is just torturing. Using children as slaves in order to turn a profit is not right. Paying CEO's 2 billion dollars a year while paying workers 6,7,8 dollars an hour is absurd. Please for the love of everyone and everything, stop being so stern in the ways of past that you refuse to admit that anything better could exist.
Fear of change is a horrible thing, especially when it is much needed. Don't be a rock, always keep your mind open to see the possibilities. Just because many of the atrocities aren't happening to you... doesn't mean they are not happening...
PS. I'm done with this thread... It's really starting to depress me..
Love to EVERYONE..
Multisingularity,
This post was highly judgmental of me. I will point out that my observations were about the video, not about you personally. I talked about my view of the video, I disagreed with your opinion, I talked about myself and I what I believe in. I asked others to come out and express their sentiments about economic systems. I made no remarks so far as your personal character.
This is supposed to be a safe place to be able to voice our truths without judgment. This is the second time in the thread you made a judgmental statement toward me. The first one I let go when you blamed me for the system. But I have to say something here because you took it past what I am willing to overlook. I do not believe personal judgments are in keeping with the decorum on this forum.
Multi, you may fall over to hear me say that I am glad you started this thread. I had the chance to voice my thoughts and I was grateful to you for that opportunity. I still am. I will freely express my views as I see fit. In the political forums, we can expect personal judgments because not everyone there is searching spiritually, but I fully expect the angels forum to be a safe place.
To rebuttal your implication that I am closed minded. I fail to see the connection with that and believing that the only thing we are slaves to is our own limiting beliefs. I stand by my comments.
To rebuttal your implication that I live safe in a bubble, as if I am disconnected from the reality of suffering, you are gravely wrong. I could go into detail about why this is so, but as a reply to a post of that nature is not how I choose to share my story here on this forum.
I'll close by saying I had planned on letting this thread go myself, as I felt satisfied about expressing my views about this. However, when I saw the last post was directed at me rather than a political belief I felt it necessary to reply.
RedBird
Last edited on Sat Nov 8th, 2008 01:32 am by RedBird
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Faye
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 02:54 am |
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Why do they keep saying the "American" dream? LOL.
I'd like to say it's your own personal dream.
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RedBird
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 05:45 am |
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Faye wrote:
Why do they keep saying the "American" dream? LOL.
I'd like to say it's your own personal dream.
In answer to your question since this touches on something new, that is because the United States was the first great modern democracy. We call it the American dream because this great ideal of freedom and opportunity is connected with national pride for us. And the words that inspired this ideal the world over are found in our Declaration of Independence.
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."
Thomas Jefferson's immortal words. If you are not in the United States, (or in your case planning on going back home to the Philippines?), then to you it will be the democratic ideal rather than the American dream. But make no mistake, this American dream as we very proudly call it, is not something we laugh about. We deeply cherish our national ideal and hold in honor those words that changed the course of world history. And we are proud to have led the world in the spread of democracy. In defense of freedom, American blood was spilled the world over. Our fallen heroes earned for us to call it what we want.
You can call it your personal dream if that is what what works for you. The term is not meant to exclude people who aren't Americans. It is for us who like to show our national pride.
RedBird
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dee
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 02:15 pm |
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this is becoming a sad situation people....just another example of how we cannot talk politics...even in this forum......that's sad. regardless of who believes what..this country is in a very very sad state of affairs.....and just to share how messed up people are out there...locally a baptist church of all African American members was burnt to the ground the other day.......all to show that there are some 'still' in this country who cannot 'get over' the fact that we are all one...that we are all equal...this was only because Obama was elected...and they consider him to be black and not good enough for this Presidency...HOW SAD IS THIS....we do not live in a free country...in my opinion....we do have war in our streets...just because it isn't in the form of 'army tanks' doesn't mean we are free.......in fact....doesn't it bother anyone out there that we don't feel 'safe' anywhere in this world? Not even in our churches where we are showing our love to God....Is this 'freedom'.???
I'm sorry but I don't feel it is...If we are such a great country why are SO many people homeless...why are 'families' homeless...children homeless.....I just can't feel freedom in this country as it is right now...I could walk down the street and get raped...shot...beaten...for NO reason at all.....just because I was there and some sick bastard felt like doing it.....how free is that?
NOW....this isn't projected at anyone...this IS my OPINION....so please please please take it for what it is.........I am also very hopeful...I also know our real freedom is coming...but not without hard times...still. If someone feels we are in a place of freedom now,,,well, just wait...you will see just how 'free' we really will be and see just how God meant for us to live....
when I see no homeless...no raped and beaten children....no more children being abducted for sexual sick perverted people...and no more shootings of someone for the color of their skin or the fact that someone walked down the wrong street where there are imaginary lines drawn for gang reasons....and the many other sick issues out there...when they are gone and done..then I will feel free............and just so everyone knows........I do love my country....believe it or not.......I do love the whole concept of being a whole.....of working together to make this a great place....like the great place it was meant to be when we strived for democracy. It just has many many flaws...
I hope, like everyone else, the flaws will be healed...we really must strive now to see it in our minds and project it...pray for it....do what ever little thing you can to work together to make it happen....
fighting amongst our selves is NOT going to make it happen.......feel the anger? feel what it does to your stomach? your blood starts boiling when you read a post you don't agree with? Pride? I cannot take pride in the way this country is at the present moment...it's still about greed and money....how sad again.....and the blood is spilled on our own turf...our own neighborhood streets...children caught in the line of fire....I can't be proud of our behavior like that...
and saying these things doesn't mean I don't want to stand up for my country ....I'm just speaking the truth of what goes on in our daily lives...just because it hasn't happened to me personally doesn't mean it doesn't go on...It does go on...in my own nice little town...every town across this country...we are flawed as a human race...and this is what has to be healed before our country can be....we as 'flawed' humans can't possibly run a great country with flawed people? Only makes sense no?
OK....so, if anyone is angry at what I say, sorry you feel that way. I just want the best for the people here in America and across the globe...thank you God for giving us the knowledge we have as lightworkers that we CAN fix it.......thank you God for giving us this next generation of 'crystal children' and the others of that generation who will teach US...the adults...how to do it right. these kids are blessed from GOD....take them under your wing people and guide them in their young age and show them how to shine in this mixed up world until they reach the age of showing us!
Blessings to everyone in this forum...we all met here for a reason....Lets not forget that ok....I truly love you all ya know.......I truly do.
Let's all just pray and send it out to that universe and call in all the angels you can muster to help us....you have to call them in...they need us to gather them and pray to them for help or this could take even longer...(that's what they just told me)
So let's get on the ball
much love fellow lightworkers!
dee
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maureen5
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 02:31 pm |
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I found this forum when I was just discovering that the angels were there and had always been there to help me. It was like discovering a whole new world. I know I was meant to find this forum and people who understood what I was about. I felt I could come here and would find friends and those who would intervene for me when I couldn't find the words.
However, I have felt during this political season that I am not "in sync" with posters. I have felt out of place. Where I had such a warm feeling for this place, I now feel a cold unacceptance. We have all been down different paths, and therefore we have different perceptions. I want to be able to "be home"when I come here. Let's not ruin that safe place to be for so many.
Love to all
m
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dee
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 02:54 pm |
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well said Maureen
thank you
dee
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RedBird
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 08:44 pm |
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It brings me joy to talk of what is good about my country and democracy. What I do not enjoy is being called close minded, or stern, and like remarks. I do not like to see posts that are laced with backhanded comments, which there has been on this thread. There is not a thing wrong in drawing your boundaries and saying you do not find something acceptable. I've been very cordial about a lot of the remarks here. I do not find anti-Americanism acceptable so I'm going to come out and say it. And I don't find personal attacks acceptable so I'll come out and say it.
Also, if somebody makes a political post or remark on this forum (and some of them have been extremely negative) if we don't agree we have every right to say so without coming under personal attack like I did in this thread.
There is a need for some very serious balance on this forum. Conservatives come here too. At this forum a lot of people come here to heal. You can't be in a safe place if you are afraid of attack. This forum needs to be a safe place also for those who disagree with the political sentiments that have been expressed in recent months. You will have to be mindful that not everyone here embraces those views.
I would also like to say there is nothing at all wrong with accepting joy and abundance now. We are not expected to wait until everybody is happy first before we can be happy. We are not expected to wait until everybody's suffering ends first before we can find relief for our own. Wild animals enjoy their freedom and they do not wait for the zoos to shut down. And there is danger for them too. They can get shot, eaten by another animal, lose their habitat. But they enjoy what they have anyway.
We may be aware of suffering, but we have a choice to focus on our blessings rather than suffering. God's love and blessings are unconditional. Abundance and joy is our gift from the universe. We can choose to accept it as is or put our own conditions on accepting it.
RedBird
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dee
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 08:56 pm |
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Redbird.......I am in no way attacking you...not at all....I never said we had to wait for abundance? I didn't say anything about abundance? of course we should find happiness...we all deserve that...we all deserve everything....I only stated I don't think, in this day and age, we should have families living in the street....elderly dieing because they can't afford to eat or eat and buy their meds...
I ALSO enjoy things....even though this world is so screwed up!
If someone wants to give an opinion then please as I said before...it is an opinion.....It was NOT an opinion to 'your' comments....I don't know why you feel attacked.....?
I said I loved my country too didn't I? but that I don't think people in this day and age can live in real freedom...because they could get shot or raped etc....from some stranger on the street....this is no attack on you........I completely respect your post....I accept YOUR post....don't you think it's only fair you respect my opinion as well....I don't take your post as an attack on me....so why are you with mine?
like I said...the joy and abundance...I don't know where that came from? what did I say to deserve that?
I'm NOT focusing on MY suffering....I feel blessed....I DO focus on the wonderful things we have in this world....I have NO suffering......in fact I"M the FIRST person on this forum who will tell someone no matter how bad things are for you it could be worse.....your making it sound as if you don't feel sorry for those homeless hurt people out there......so, please explain it to me?
I have NEVER focused on my suffering....I can't believe you said that to me....where is all this coming from? what the hell did I ever do to you?
I don't put conditions on anything......please don't put words in my mouth...........You've said enough
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RedBird
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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 10:21 pm |
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dee wrote:
Redbird.......I am in no way attacking you...not at all....I never said we had to wait for abundance? I didn't say anything about abundance? of course we should find happiness...we all deserve that...we all deserve everything....I only stated I don't think, in this day and age, we should have families living in the street....elderly dieing because they can't afford to eat or eat and buy their meds...
I ALSO enjoy things....even though this world is so screwed up!
If someone wants to give an opinion then please as I said before...it is an opinion.....It was NOT an opinion to 'your' comments....I don't know why you feel attacked.....?
I said I loved my country too didn't I? but that I don't think people in this day and age can live in real freedom...because they could get shot or raped etc....from some stranger on the street....this is no attack on you........I completely respect your post....I accept YOUR post....don't you think it's only fair you respect my opinion as well....I don't take your post as an attack on me....so why are you with mine?
like I said...the joy and abundance...I don't know where that came from? what did I say to deserve that?
I'm NOT focusing on MY suffering....I feel blessed....I DO focus on the wonderful things we have in this world....I have NO suffering......in fact I"M the FIRST person on this forum who will tell someone no matter how bad things are for you it could be worse.....your making it sound as if you don't feel sorry for those homeless hurt people out there......so, please explain it to me?
I have NEVER focused on my suffering....I can't believe you said that to me....where is all this coming from? what the hell did I ever do to you?
I don't put conditions on anything......please don't put words in my mouth...........You've said enough
The attack I was referring to was when another member called me closed minded and a number of other things. You can read it up on the thread. I think you should cool down.
My other comments were not directed to you personally. It's okay, Dee. We're cool. You know, you're a bastion here at this forum. A lot of people have relied on you for support, including myself. I will, though, ask you not to curse at me and tell me I've said enough. Though I think something upset you, or you would not have spoken to me that way.
I've been referring about abundance and belief systems since my first post on this thread. There's a lot of great material about it, and I've been applying it to myself. It's what I usually talk about here. The lessons I've learned. And I had welcomed this thread to share about things I have learned.
So, you're okay? Olive branch? Come on, who on this forum told me to take care of myself…who told me I needed to feel more deserving? That was you.
RedBird
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dee
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Posted: Sun Nov 9th, 2008 10:54 pm |
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| yup,we're ok......dee
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Multisingularity
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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 12:23 am |
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... ok... I know I said I was closed with this, but Redbird.. In a very nice way, you are taking my own opinions and making them look like direct insults at you. I'm not insulting you in general... Nor am I really insulting anyone. I am merely stating a fact.
Conservatism = not wanting change = liking things exactly how they are = fear of change = inability to accept that things could be better, or just accepting that you don't mind the country as it is = close minded and ignoring all of the suffering that DOES occur... to you or not.
An example of what I mean is I got an email from a conservative supporting McCain before the election. It called all democrats socialist elitist liberals. Now why this baffles me is if someone is socialist, they are claiming we all deserve everything.. How can someone like that possibly be an elitist? The two terms contradict themselves.
In addition to this, once you start bringing in your own personal experiences into a discussion... aka. talking about your grandfather.. the way to counter that is to counter your personal argument.. Hence the conversation is made personal.
I am sorry that I get worked up over this, but it infuriates me when people claim that things are just fine the way they are.
Yes, it is OK to be happy now. It is OK to love and appreciate your own personal gains, but this is not abundance.. You can't ignore all those in this country that are suffering. We are not in abundance yet if it is not there for everyone. Abundance is abundant... hence the term... enough for everyone.
If I was anti-American, I wouldn't be trying to open people's minds... i would just move to Canada or Australia.
There is so much good on the horizon, but in order for it to come, we all need to want it to come. Wanting the world to be beautiful, sadly, does take more than just prayer. It takes acceptance and personal will. We are not going to get there by forcing morals on people... Religions have tried this for thousands of years... We are going to get there by finsing a common love for everyone... By teaching love and compassion, things that everyone can understand and can't be argued.
Redbird, I knew the whole time you liked this topic. I read your post on the other topic describing how much you loved this topic. To be honest, I am kind of enjoyign this myself, because I see you as a challenge. If I can convince you to open your eyes, than it shows the world has hope.
Change is not a bad thing. Especially when it is controlled change.
Change is the only universal constant.
Also, I want to add.. Though I am not a huge fan of capitalism in general, as it does set the grounds for an elitist system, the system itself is only a small small part of the problem. Greed and corruption are what take a system, no matter how corrupt it may be from the start, and ruin it.
Redbird, I am sorry if I personally offended you.. I feel my major issue was not my sediments, but moreso the words I used to describe them. Close minded is a term with a very negative connotation to it, but if you really look at the statement, all it really means is inability to look at the world and see anything different as a viable solution.
I am not claiming I know exactly what would be best... Just that I know things can be better.
As far as the video goes, if you don't like the sediments behind it, just pay attention to the facts it presents. Just because you don't like hearing them, doesn't make them not true. (That statement is not directed at anyone and holds true for any situation).
I hope this helps things a litte. Again, I appologize for the terms I used.
PEACE... and LOVE.... to EVERYone.
-me-
P.S. Dee... You are wonderful... Big Bih <3's to you 
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